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thoughts please! Call pre-flop?
Some thoughts for why to call:
-Stack sizes are more than 20 times the amount I have to call--decent payoff if I stack opponent
-2 players in the hand (not just a single opponent) -- more likely to get action if I flop well
-opponents are weak players and more likely to payoff
-I have position
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Your comments are much appreciated! Some thoughts for why to call:
-Stack sizes are more than 20 times the amount I have to call--decent payoff if I stack opponent
-2 players in the hand (not just a single opponent) -- more likely to get action if I flop well
-opponents are weak players and more likely to payoff
-I have position
BTW advisors recommend fold
Odds of flopping a flush are under 1% so the pre-Flop pot odds are dismal. If you flop a flush draw, how do you play it, especially if one of the players in front of you make a size pot bet? If you flop a flush and you bet, do you really think you will get much action? And if you get called and the turn is another heart, where does that leave you? Don't see much argument for a call preflop with that hand I'm afraid
the math says to fold. if one more caller it would be worth the call. if I was going to play this hand it would be a good choice for a three bet bluff other than this I would agree a fold is solid play.
This humble donkey folds the hand without a second thought here. While you would have position post flop, the potential negatives so far outweigh the positives that anything other than a fold is massively -EV. I wouldn't use this hand as a 3-bet bluff from the button vs an EP open either here. I'd be happier trying that with A5s or maybe KJs where I can sometimes take a flop in position if 4-bet. This hand blocks nothing and doesn't have enough equity vs a 4-bet range to do that with. If I'm 3-bet/folding too much, I'm going to get punished. If I was 1 of the blinds, and had another caller, I could possibly see the math working out but not here.
So, the 1 thing in your favor is you would have position post flop, if you got to see a flop. You aren't closing the action here and there are the 2 blinds and the UTG limper still to act. You flatting gives extra incentive for 1 of these players to 3-bet, attacking what looks like a ton of dead money. Along the lines of what I stated above, the more callers lined up after the initial open, the wider ranges someone can attack all that money with. The initial raiser has to fold a ton of hands to that play and 4-bet most of the rest to avoid being OOP multiway in a big pot. Your hand cannot survive any further action so there is a decent chance you put money out just to have to fold anyway.
If you get to see a flop, what is your best case scenario? Almost every potential board kills your hand, or worse. Flush draws kill action and in the event they don't, you are likely against a bigger one. On the miniscule chance you flop an OESF draw, action is killed and you aren't getting paid. Most straights and straight draws leave you vulnerable to bigger straights. Plus, those boards are rarely getting good action from worse hands. Your best outcome is flopping trip 6's and even there, if you are getting action to a paired board, you are likely crushed by a FH. Trip 9's are worse for you with action because every possible other combo of 9 has you outkicked.
I know these hands look tempting but you have to let them go. Most of the time they miss the world and the times they connect, either you get no action or the action you get leaves you broke. Set mining is more effective because those small pairs are well disguised. Hands like this one just aren't.
You don't have the odds to call.
2.5 to 1 at time of call. 4.4 to1 once utg+1 calls.
9 to 1 i call any two. 7.5 to 1 at least since you will extract some c-bets/ implied odds from the 3bettor.
Do some range work. Pull up an equity calculator. Input ranges of your opponents. ( What are they 3 betting with? Calling 3bets with?
Then your range input. Hit calculate.
Guessing your equity is about 10-15% area. If odds don't match equity, it is an unprofitable call.
Remember. If you make 10 $8 call check folds in a session, that's 40% of your stack ar 1/2.
Burning money.